Hi, this is a proposal for the login, not properly for a feature.
I think that “Log in to your server” is a bit geek-oriented, why don’t use something more simple like “insert your email” or “login with your email”, etc.
I imagine my father asking me “what the xxxx is the server?”!
Delta Chat should be simple for everyone.
Thanks
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People get told to give nobody their email password, so they are afraid to type it in.
login with your email -> some people think it means signup with your email address and an unique password.
So the solution is not as straightforward as one might think.
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Now I understand the reason, thanks.
If people understand what DC is, I don’t think they will be afraid to give the pwd like in any other client. If someone doesn’t really understand, probably a screen with a very short introduction will solve the question.
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I think it should be similar to the other mail clients,
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For example, on K9 it says “Set up a new account” but for dc it would be a problem: unfortunately all the chat apps WhatsApp, Telegram, Signal & C. require registration. DC no. Describing what DC is in a nutshell is not easy, writing a description that is too long will not be read.
A way should be found to make people understand what DC is.
If it is not specified that DC is an e-mail client it will always be difficult to make it clear that to use DC you do not have to register with any service.
Actually I find the definition “log in to your server” quite misleading (in the end if I don’t self-host an email server I actually log in on the provider’s server) and I think it is better to use “add account” or “add your email account”, also to standardize the terminology since when you select “switch account” from the menu then the item to add a new account is, in fact, “add account”.
But it’s true that inexperienced users could misunderstand and for this reason maybe it would be useful if there was a page (displayed only when the app is started for the first time or only when no account is configured) in which it is explained that DC is an email client and that the data entered remain exclusively on the device. I’ve often seen introductory pages in other apps and it seems to me that this might be an acceptable solution.
Another thing that doesn’t convince me much is that when you get to the screen to enter your username and password it says “Consult your e-mail provider or friends for help”. I agree with the fact that if you have problems configuring the account you can contact your provider but what about friends? I’m afraid that in most cases friends may know less than the new user and probably the recurring response would be: “stop trying to use these complicated apps and go back to using whatsapp!”
So I would remove the part that recommends to ask for help to friends and instead I would add a link to https://providers.delta.chat/ that can actually be useful to know if your provider is compatible with DC or if you need to do some kind of “preparation” to make it work properly.
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Indeed, asking a friend is not always the best solution, especially if friends know less than you 
I agree with this. The current sign-in is too unfriendly and I would be uncomfortable sharing the app with others.
I personally exited the app when I saw it just wanted me to type in user & pass. There was no indication I could authorise directly with Gmail.
In my mind it should be icons of the most popular email providers, “Choose an email account to use”
Click one to oauth via web or internally (isn’t there a native way to do that on android for gmail?). Then a ‘custom’ link for those that need to be set up manually.
As I’ve already written I’m in favor of making clearer the fact that delta chat is an email client and give more information to the user on how to configure it, but I’m also strongly opposed to the introduction of provider icons to login: in my opinion delta chat must remain as neutral as possible with respect to the choice of the provider also because I think that is one of its strengths the fact that it can be used with virtually any provider.
It’s my understanding DC provides oauth for certain email providers, so I don’t see a problem with clearly showing those providers? Familiarity provides confidence.
At the very least it should only ask for email initially. It can then direct you to an available authorisation method or educate you about the steps required.
its not a sign-up its a sign in
I have set up a few gmail accounts of family and friends and if I remember correctly, delta chat is exactly how it works enter username and password and it opens the browser to perform oauth authentication.
On android at least, the initial screen shows a username and password box. It’s only after you type a gmail hosted email address, and move focus to the password box, that a message pops up offering oauth. It’s all very clunky and people may very well exit the app before they get to that point.
and on telegram, WhatsApp and co. you need to type in your phone number. so in Deltachat you need to type in your email address. Not that different if you ask me - on all those apps you need to first know who you are.
The difference here is that the initial screen shows a username and password box, with no indication that it supports oauth. Handing over your password to an email account, which very well might be connected to many other services, is very different from providing a mobile number. Open source or not, many people will be very wary of this and may just exit the app. That’s my main feedback.
The phone number in many states is directly linked to your real identity so it’s not something to underestimate.
However, beyond this, I repeat that I think it is necessary to make clear to the user what kind of application he is using and how to configure it, and highlight the fact that username and password remain on the device, but I do not see the need to crowd the login screen with the icons of the most popular providers.
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So you believe its better to first have email address put in on a separate page from the other info just to less scare gmail and yandex users (the both services for which we have oauth support on android at the moment)?
I think that would be more annoying for other users, say for example if you mistyped your email and want to edit it you would need to go back to the previous screen then back to the second screen.
Maybe we could make it on one page, first show the email address and once typed in show the other fields? but that could also have disadvantages.
Looks like @martiansteve’s people’s fear is more about loosing their google account identity than exposing their identity.
So were back to the main question "how do we explain to users the concept of an local email client, so they don’t react with their fishing protection advice someone hopefully gave them “do not give your email password out to anyone”.
But then I’m not sure how many people even know that, I know enough folks that reuse their password on every site, to know that we need more education about the digital stuff, especially about security.
Though this topic was brought up multiply times already so there is clearly a demand for an solution.
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IMO this message would be more helpful still being accurate:
Sign in with your already existing email account
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This message can be read as “sign into the Delta Chat server using your existing email account”. The point is that you sign into your email server, not some special Delta Chat server set up by Delta Chat developers.
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if we don’t want to invite people to go on their first login here is my opinion:
I am speaking as an end user: since how long to log in you have to manually enter your account data. When you want to facilitate access to an app for your users, you need to facilitate them completely; do you think that “LOGIN TO YOUR SERVER” is enough to reassure a user to migrate?
We want to talk about the message on the next screen (the one below your email address and password):
“ There is no Delta Chat server, your data remains on your device!”
The purpose of this message is clear to me:
reassure users about respect for privacy on delta chat! But putting it immediately under username and password is absolutely misleading. Why?
Simple, because the average user, (but also the most geeky millennials) will never understand that in those fields he must enter the real data of his e-mail account and, moreover, the message below (however significant) leads right astray. It shouldn’t be put there.
Returning to the initial question … or “login to your server”, if you really want to keep this expression, (I do not understand the reasons), you should know that it would be necessary to make it clear and unequivocal to users, that in the password and email fields they go our personal data.
The ideal solution for me:
“Sign in with your already existing email account” as the user said above.
But even better could be the login that sends me back to my email account already stored on the phone (be it Gmail Yahoo or anyone). I don’t know if this can be done. (I always speak as an end user and not as a programmer.
Ciao ciao e grazie per avermi letto
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